Template talk:Place Summary

Showhide Location Codes

In order to reduce length of the location codes section in the summary, we've been trying to use a Showhide template to javascript long lists away.

One problem with this is finding a way for Showhide code to somehow hide table rows and cells, without this functionality, great lengths must be used in order to format the Location Codes in a pleasing way.

GuildKnight suggests we set the cells side-by-side, making for a balanced look. However; since there are pages like Bloodmoon:Altar of Thrond without any other split summary cells, the "[ hide ]" just gets crammed to the side and it looks bad.

Elliot likes it better with the cell data appearing underneath the location codes title. This is what I'm leaving it at, so that this summary template doesn't break anything.

Any thoughts? I'm quite open to suggestions on how to hack it. Lukish_ Tlk Cnt 21:17, 2 October 2009 (UTC)

Elliot's sandbox looks fine, and if it's the one that works on the articles, then it's the one we should use; however, I don't like the way the summary is currently set up... it's clumsy and rather ugly, especially in that the columns' widths change when the info is shown/hidden. If this is the only way to do it, I'd rather not hide the codes. If, on the other hand, there's a way to have only the show/hide tag in the cell beside the label, and then have the info show in a row beneath those two cells when it's not hidden, that would be perfect!  ;) --GK^Talk2me 23:07, 2 October 2009 (UTC)

The cells are vertical as it was before and is in Elliot's look, but I haven't found a way to include cell info with Showhide, so until we can hack it, this will do. I also want to mention that I'm looking for an efficient way to measure the number of parameters in "locationcode" in order to just display static if it's a few, or Showhide if it's a bunch. Lukish_ Tlk Cnt 00:37, 3 October 2009 (UTC)

I reverted this template back to the original, with no show/hide until we can figure something out. Before I reverted it, it was similar to Elliot's idea, but if you look at the second infobox on Elliot's sandbox, it shows that his idea was similar to mine. When it's shown, the info is shown below the "Console Location Code" cell, not beside it. When the codes are shown beside the "Console Location Code" cell, it alters the column widths; also, as you mentioned before, it ruined infoboxes that don't otherwise have second columns. It's hard to explain in words, but hopefully we can figure out something that works. --GK^Talk2me 01:06, 3 October 2009 (UTC)

Right, that's what I meant by they are vertical now, I had to go before right after I made the original post here, and it is fixed to look nice now, except for those things I mentioned in my previous post. Lukish_ Tlk Cnt 01:12, 3 October 2009 (UTC)

I don't really like much the show/hide of the console locations. The infobox doesn't become that large, and I don't see why it is necessary to hide pieces of information. It's currently the only infobox with a show/hide part, so it's hardly consistent. The only parts one the site we currently use show/hide is for the OBNPCRP (where it hides mere meta data) and Deletion Review (where it serves as a collapsable menu) so I don't see why we need to hide just this particular part of information. The infobox is deliberately not placed in the normal document flow, but rather placed at the side so it doesn't seperate the content parts. --Timenn-<talk> 14:28, 5 October 2009 (UTC)

(outdent)It's not really necessary; we're only trying to prevent the infobox from becoming so large that it obstructs other things on the page. Check out the size of Castle Chorrol's infobox, were it not collapsed. Either way is fine with me in the long run, though. --GK^Talk2me 18:28, 5 October 2009 (UTC)

I have reverted it until we can figure out a better way to do it. For now, the small tags seems to suffice, so we aren't really in a hurry to "fix" this. –Elliot ^talk 22:05, 5 October 2009 (UTC)

I agree, small tags are good for now. In the future, I would like to see some logic introduced to the template which can auto-format or Showhide longer listings, but that's far from a pressing matter. Lukish_ Tlk Cnt 02:16, 7 October 2009 (UTC)

Map link/ mw places summary

Map link is not displayed. Why do we use both this template and the morrowind places summary template? Marcel 11:34, 20 February 2010 (UTC)

This template is badly in need of a re-write and I think I'll prioritize that and do it today. The map link is displayed under some circumstances like the Location line at Morrowind:Holamayan but the template is too complex for me to tell quickly what those circumstances are and why it isn't displayed on many pages.

There are currently four Place Summary templates (Lore Place Summary, Morrowind Places Summary, Oblivion Places Summary, Place Summary) that I can find. It probably won't be done today but I'll put it on my list to examine and merge the templates if appropriate. ‒ Joram↝Talk 18:52, 20 February 2010 (UTC)

It's already on my list of things to do, and I've already started making steps in this direction, which is what Template:Place Summary/Morrowind and Template:Place Summary/Oblivion are about.

Map link *does* display on this template if the necessary parameters are filled in.

{{Lore Place Summary}} is something totally different and needs to be kept separate. rpeh •T•C•E• 19:24, 20 February 2010 (UTC)

I thought you might have been working on it but I wasn't sure how far you'd gone. I'll have a look at the sub-pages as well if I have time but for now I'll just work on simplifying what's in Place Summary itself. ‒ Joram↝Talk 20:27, 20 February 2010 (UTC)

I've not got too far as other things have got ahead in the queue. If you want to take it on, please feel free - I'd be very grateful! rpeh •T•C•E• 20:47, 20 February 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for the replies. I haven't figured out how to get at the template source (yet), but here's what i found based on your reactions and the template descriptions:

The maplink on the place summary is displayed in the location header and will only show up if there is a location description entered (like: location=North-West of Maar Gan), on the Morrowind Places Summary the maplink is displayed next to the generated region info (like grazelands [-4,6]). So a quick fix could be to move maplink location on the Place Summary to the region info. If you want to consolidate the templates, i've compared the parameters:
Shared parameters:

• titlename: PS defaults to pagename, MPS defaults to subpagename. MPS sanitizes text in parentheses from subpagename.
• type: type of location, some are connected to additional parameters
• locationcode:required on MPS, value none hides the entry for PS.
• mapname: MPS defaults to titlename, PS defaults to pagename, MPS shows link next to generated region info while PS shows it next to the location header.
• region: autohidden when omitted on PS, needs value none on MPS to supress.
• coords: autohidden when omitted on PS, needs region=none on MPS to supress.
• location: description of location (south of molag mar) needed on PS in order for maplink to show up.
• addabove
• addbelow
• image
• imgdesc: listed as optional in PS and mandatory in MPS (if there is an image value) No warnings are generated if omitted, but i havent checked whether it will show up on the verification list.

Parameters unique to MPS:

• zones: listed as optional, but omitting this will send it to the verification category
• occupants: listed as optional, but omitting this will send it to the verification category
• extaloc: optional extra small font location info
• description:propagated to linking pages (places pages)
• ns_base:default link namespace
• notrail:supress trail and categories

Parameters unique to PS:

• city:alternative for location parameter (mutually exclusive)
• regionx:mechanism for enumerating additional regions spanned by this location
• district:only for vivec and imperial city (autolinked)
• destX, destXalt: mechanism for enumerating fast travel destinations, autolinked (nice idea but implementation could be simpler)
• Almsivi+Divine:destinations for intervention spells (autolinked)

Place specific variables:

• MPS: daedra,kollops,minetype,samples, propylon1+2,shrine(x)
• PS: prop,propname,count,countess,prim,heal,priest,saint,roomcost,gold,merc (most of these duplicate info should already be in the people table)

If the pages that use PS were migrated to MPS, i think the 2 main problems would be that they will need to have data for zones and occupants added and we would lose the useful Divine and Almsivi parameters. Marcel 02:18, 21 February 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for the information, I'll have a look at it all as well as the sub-templates tomorrow. I've cleaned up the existing template with a couple of changes to the display for consistency. Map links now appear on everything though, which may not be desirable. If not we'll have to figure out when they should be displayed. Samples are User:Joram/Vav|here or you can test it on any page with a Place Summary template by changing 'Place Summary' to 'User:Joram/He', but don't save it that way. ;) Any feedback from either of you would be great. ‒ Joram↝Talk 04:09, 21 February 2010 (UTC)

One thing I wanted to change is the stupid number of job-specific params on Place Summary (count/countess/heal/saint). There should be a job1/job2/job3 and jobtitle1/jobtitle2 etc system instead. I don't think too many pages use the job titles so it shouldn't be too much of a trial to move things over, but RoBoT can help if necessary. rpeh •T•C•E• 11:48, 21 February 2010 (UTC)

Joram's new version looks better than the morrowind places summary. Zafirbel Bay is one of the few locations that does not have a corresponding map entry, but the mapname=none mechanism is already in place to fix that.Marcel 14:36, 21 February 2010 (UTC)

I'd been thinking of changing the job titles as well. Since it's been seconded I'll go ahead and do that, and if I can I'll work on the merger of the templates too later tonight. ‒ Joram↝Talk 22:03, 21 February 2010 (UTC)

That's it for me for tonight, I can't focus. If one of you feels like reviewing the output of {{User:Joram/He}} compared to OPS/MPS/PS, please let me know if there's anything else outstanding. I moved some of the OPS lines into Joram/He and as I said in the edit summary I left treasure in the main template since it can probably be used for Morrowind as well. I tried to organize information logically but go ahead and re-arrange if you want. Consider this official permission to edit either He or Vav if you want. ‒ Joram↝Talk 01:40, 23 February 2010 (UTC)

Mapname error

I noticed that the mapname needs to be explicitly specified for any Location that has an apostrophe in its name, otherwise it escapes the apostrophe to & #39; and then escapes that to %26%2339%3B and searches for that name --Brf 16:04, 7 October 2010 (UTC)

I went through all of the Morrowind and Bloodmoon Places with apostrophes in their names and added the mapname tag. I do not know if it is easy, or even possible, to fix this template to default the mapname correctly, or the map code to accept the %26%2339%3B thingee. --Brf 19:19, 7 October 2010 (UTC)

This issue actually came up about a year ago, and I remember thinking at the time that it was a server-side problem and we'd have to correct them all manually. And it looks like you've done that quite well! I'm not sure how you found them all that quickly, but feel free to to any you find in Oblivion as well. I'll have another look at the template later today, now that I've got more experience with them, and see if there's anything that can/should be done there, but I suspect that manual correction is still gonna be the only way to go. Even if I do find a fix/workaround, it certainly won't hurt to have the manual map names there. – Robin Hood↝talk 19:49, 7 October 2010 (UTC)

Actually, they were easy to find. I started from Category:Morrowind-Places and looked for apostrophes --Brf 19:58, 7 October 2010 (UTC)

This is the problem with being a bot programmer...my mind jumped immediately to a bot solution rather than the simple one! :) – Robin Hood↝talk 20:11, 7 October 2010 (UTC)

I believe I've fixed the problem now. See the next subject for details. – Robin Hood↝talk 23:34, 7 October 2010 (UTC)

Wrong Map Links

For some map links, notably those with apostrophes, we were getting HTML- and then URL-encoded names. This is now fixed, but I wanted to document it, as it relies on a slight difference in UESP's Magic Words and the built-in MediaWiki ones. Specifically, the built-in {{SUBPAGENAME}} returns HTML-escaped characters, such as ' instead of an apostrophe. {{CORENAME}} and {{LABELNAME}} don't do this, so I changed the {{#label:{{SUBPAGENAME}}}} into simply {{LABELNAME}} for now, after double-checking that none of the pages using it were the "special" ones for LABEL/CORENAME. If the functionality of UESP's Magic Words is ever changed to match those of the MediaWiki ones, another solution will have to be found. – Robin Hood↝talk 23:44, 7 October 2010 (UTC)

In that case couldn't we just change back to what caused the problem, I.E that {{SUBPAGENAME}} was using the default Magic Words? (If I understood this correctly that is. If not what exactly is the problem?)--Ghurhak gro-Demril _{or TAO}^Yes? 23:54, 7 October 2010 (UTC)

You mean if the UESP Magic Words were changed? Yes, we could then just change back (or leave it as it is, either way) and use the mapname parameter to override it as we've been doing up till now. – Robin Hood↝talk 00:04, 8 October 2010 (UTC)

Yip! I was referring specifically to "If the functionality of UESP's Magic Words is ever changed to match those of the MediaWiki ones, another solution will have to be found." this section of your post.--Ghurhak gro-Demril _{or TAO}^Yes? 00:11, 8 October 2010 (UTC)

Skyrim Changes

A list of changes we should make to this template (preferably all at once for the sake of the server)

• Add clearable tag
• Add ways of specifying all ore veins (borrow from MW?)
• Add params such as sawmill, blacksmith, cooking, tanning, forge, grindstone, workbench, etc. (should equipment be a service? Or service only if NPC required?)
• Add a param such as marker_id that provides the exact marker_id for this place; could then be used in future to display the correct icon (can't just go by type parameter, because the two values can be slightly different).
• Add dungeon tag. I'm adding it to the place pages already, because it's a relatively easy to tag to pull out of the game data. I'm not altogether sure what it's significance is, though.

--Nephele^Talk 08:27, 15 November 2011 (UTC)

What is the use of the dungeon tag? There is already a type tag. Although it is easy to pull it from the game data, the dungeon-tag is useless information. Just a consideration. --CoolGamer 23:31, 26 November 2011 (UTC)

Would a respawing tag be worthwhile? There seems to be quite a few dungeons that respawn neither occupants nor container contents. In some, even corpses aren't being cleaned up. Foubister 21:13, 4 February 2012 (UTC)

I think it might well be, but we're still trying to get a feel for what's desirable in terms of page content. – Robin Hood↝talk 06:02, 1 March 2012 (UTC)

Publican duplication

It seems if you add a treasure tag to a place where there is a job present it will produce an unusued Publican on the page. See: Skyrim:Dead Man's Drink for example.--Bwross 14:53, 28 December 2011 (UTC)

I tweaked the template, so the issue is gone now on the example page, and should disappear shortly on other pages having that problem. --Alfwyn 14:07, 29 December 2011 (UTC)

Ore Veins

Specify ore veins only when inside a location's interior? Or "in and around"? --JR (talk) 06:54, 7 October 2012 (GMT)

Maplinks

Two things from my wish-list for maplinks:

• I want to be able to specify a map zoom. That would be useful for things like houses or mountain ranges.
• It would be nice if the saved parameter used by {{Place Link}} would be all the parameters for the map url. Currently a different map/namespace is not saved/used, zoom would make the problem more common. Saving them all separately or just together in one string could both work - does anything else use the saved map parameters?

Just looking for opinions/info about that at the moment. --Alfwyn (talk) 22:19, 26 January 2014 (GMT)

Problem with cross-namespace places

An example would be Tes5Mod: Beyond Skyrim/Dawn's Venture. Its city parameter is in Skyrim proper, so either it's properly linked and you break the category, or it's not and you break the link. Looking at the template code, it seems this could be solved by putting the {{#trimlinks:}} stuff around the citydesc parts of the categories section; but I hesitate to do it myself. --Gez (talk) 11:44, 26 December 2020 (UTC)

I've gone ahead and made that change, although I renamed it to citycat, since it's not a description in any way. You can also override that, although it's only the city name in the category, not the entire category, which leaves the issue of a Tes5Mod-Beyond Skyrim-Places-Dawnstar category. I don't know if that's wanted or not, but I'm thinking probably not...? I don't see an easy way around that, so the "fix", at least for now, might be just to plop a redirect on that page that points to the one for Skyrim itself. At some point, I think the template might need a redesign to better handle different bases, but that's a larger project, if it needs to be done at all. – Robin Hood ^(talk) 22:50, 26 December 2020 (UTC)