User talk:Nephele/Archive-2009-05

Your comment on my discussion page

You know Nephele, what gets me about this whole thing is YOU. You know that you implied some sort of failing on my part by saying "I don't know why it would take you 30 minutes to scan a page." I would be more inclined to believe that I misunderstood your intent, if there were not so many other users on this forum that have been more blatant examples of your belittlement. Don't act like you don't know what I am talking about. This site was created for people who are having trouble with the game, and not (I hope) a forum for your supposed genius. Try being nicer to us! We are your audience, buddy! Don't put us down. Your work on this site is exemplary, but your interaction with the readers here is arrogant, condescending and just plain mean. There is a friggin' movement against you, fella'. Personally, I am done with this whole affair. I have a life that keeps me busy and my friends are already tired of me airing my grievances with them about it. To tell you the truth, when I started networking and investigating some of your other put downs here: I felt lucky that I got off relatively unscathed. You should be ashamed of the way you treat people...67.181.190.29 21:42, 1 May 2009 (EDT)

Nudge

Sorry to bug you, but did you see this post? Previous code-related questions have been answered super-fast so I'm guessing this one just passed you by.

We're still getting some unwanted Wanted Categories and a few unwanted Wanted Pages are showing up too. Is it something I'm doing wrong with the NS_* magic words, or is there a buglet that needs fixing? –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 15:32, 4 May 2009 (EDT)

Sorry about that

Yeah, got your message about the lore: Khajiit page. I could have sworn they were unessissary. Oh well, tyvm for the correction ^_^ (hey, Im sure I'll get better as time goes by :D)

Underboss 23:25, 4 May 2009 (EDT)

No problem :) --Nephele^Talk 00:12, 5 May 2009 (EDT)

Re-uploading the images

I've tried re-uploading the NPC images, only to find that nothing had happened and that the image was still the same as before. I tried twice on the Arvena Thelas image (here) but to no avail. Maybe because the image I'm trying to upload alreayd exists on the site? --SerCenKing ^Talk 11:37, 6 May 2009 (EDT)

Both uploads worked fine (for example, you can see them both listed in the image's file history); when I look at the page, I'm seeing your version of the image. The problem is just that your computer doesn't realize that the image has changed: you need to hit Ctrl-F5 to do a full reload of the page, and make sure that you're seeing the current version of the page and the displayed images. --Nephele^Talk 11:48, 6 May 2009 (EDT)

Yay! After two reloads it worked! Thanks Neph, you're my hero! XD --SerCenKing ^Talk 11:52, 6 May 2009 (EDT)

D:

Indefinite blocks for IP addresses? Is this site really run this way? While I don't mind, I find it easier to block spambots for a month to up to three months because they are almost always using open proxies and they are almost always never used again BY THE SAME SPAMBOT. This is not to say that it won't be used by other spambots, but a medium-length block makes the spambots start using other IP addresses and then we can block those for a month to three months, and by the time the old one is released from the block, none of the spambots use it again, or if they do, which is very rare, it is always easy to block them again. We should not aim to not let people never contribute by blocking an IP address indefinitely, rather, a short to medium-term block is sufficient in my mind.

If you guys allow indefinite blocks to be placed on IPs, then don't read my helpful suggestion above, but rather, just reply saying that you do allow indefinite blocks, in which case, I will happily reply thanks :) Cheers, Razorflame 15:36, 7 May 2009 (EDT)

Yes, indefinite blocks on IPs used by spambots and/or open proxies has been our practice, as well being part of our policy: see UESPWiki:Blocking Policy#Blocking an Account, specifically the bullets about "An anonymous IP address that has been used solely for the purpose of posting spam...." and "An anonymous IP address that is identified as an Open Proxy or Zombie Computer...." I'd be open to a discussion about whether we should instead move to 3-month duration blocks in such cases, but probably the policy talk page would be a better place for such a discussion. --Nephele^Talk 16:23, 7 May 2009 (EDT)

No need to. If it's been standard practice on this site for a while or a long time, then no need to change it. If it is working well for you guys, then by all means, keep on using it :) Cheers, Razorflame 16:25, 7 May 2009 (EDT)

Title capitalization

Hi there. I believe that for only the UESP Wiki prefixed pages, we should not use title capitalization. After reading both of the pages that you linked me to, it stated that global title capitalization should not be required, and also, title capitalization does not make for a "professional" look, which all UESP Wiki prefixed pages should have, in my opinion. While I am not against keeping it, I just thought that maybe we should try to look as professional as we can while keeping to what we do best. Thanks, Razorflame 16:18, 10 May 2009 (EDT)

Personally, I think that using traditional title capitalization looks more professional than Wikipedia-style title capitalization. After all, that's the capitalization style used in nearly all printed publications (professional journals, reference books, newspapers, etc.). I think Wikipedia-style capitalization looks informal and is often done for convenience or simplicity -- neither of which indicates professionalism.

Furthermore, that is the agreed-upon standard for this site. Even if none of our style guidelines are "required", nevertheless, they are still the recommendations, and those recommendations apply equally to the UESPWiki namespace as to any other namespace on the site. It would be particularly inconsistent to have UESPWiki-prefixed pages such as UESPWiki:Spelling and UESPWiki:Style Guide not follow the guidelines written within those same articles. Therefore, I don't think it is reasonable to break our site's guidelines within the UESPWiki namespace. --Nephele^Talk 17:06, 10 May 2009 (EDT)

Fair enough :) Thanks for the clarification!  :D Cheers, Razorflame 17:28, 10 May 2009 (EDT)

Not that my vote is needed here, but I second Nephele's reasoning. :) I've never liked Wikipedia's style of only capitalizing the first letter..."Title Case" is named such for a reason, after all. ;) --Robin Hood (Talk • E-mail • Contribs) 21:16, 10 May 2009 (EDT)

Leveled NPCs

I've recently been trying to enter the health and magicka params that are missing in some NPCs pages. I have used the formulas for calculating the two values but I haven't been quite able to figure it out. I tried to take an NPC's formula and see how it related to the CS and the formula in OB:NPC page, but was left puzzled. I could not find a relationship between the additions and multiplications nor where the numbers came from. Two major problems are: how does LevelFactor work if the the NPC is leveled? And what happens if his stats are auto-calced? --SerCenKing ^Talk 11:05, 13 May 2009 (EDT)

LevelFactor always applies to leveled NPCs. However, it has not been included in the equation shown on NPC pages because it would just make those equations even more impossible for anyone to figure out. All leveled NPCs have auto-calc'ed stats. Other than that, all I can say is that all of the equations are provided at Oblivion:NPCs; at this point, that page is my only source for information, so I can't tell you anything more than what's there. --Nephele^Talk 11:27, 13 May 2009 (EDT)

Well, I hope I don't ask too much for a little clarification. So LevelFactor is not in the equations, that's a bit confusing: how can you get a correct equation without a part of it? Let's take Eletta for example. This is the equation for health: NPC_Health = LevelFactor * [ (NPC_Level-1)*ClassFactor + (Strength + Endurance)/2 ]. This is Eletta's: 48 + (4+1)x(PC+0), PC=4-32. So 48 is the Strength and Endurance divided by 2, rounded up. But what is (4+1)? Is 1 the LevelFactor and 4 the Class Factor? If so, why are they added together and not summed? I suppose PC+0 means the PC's level + 0 (which is the offset); but what is PC=4-32? I can't find either of the two numbers anywhere... Sorry if this is a motherload of questions, but I would really like to understand how this thing works. --SerCenKing ^Talk 13:03, 15 May 2009 (EDT)

Perhaps this discussion will help, since that's where specifically the health provided in NPC infoboxes was discussed. --Nephele^Talk 13:59, 15 May 2009 (EDT)

Some thoughts...

Well dear Neph time has passed and as it seems I haven't introduced myself. Well I'm Lord Geogorath the famous counsel of Tiberius Stormrider. In the passing days I realized something weird in this wikia that doesn't happen on other wikias. Though quite old and big this wikia has a bad habit. Its administrators though. They seem to have a bad habit. Not all of them. Some are the best I have ever met. But some others... believe that this wikia is their fief. Yup. No offense but as it seems the Elder Scrolls Wikia though it is 1/4 in size of your wikia it grows too quick. Know this:Tiberius Stormrider was the first wikian to reach your website. And then you treated him like some kind of alien threat. After all you've won the reputation of a desolate world not meant to be reached by anymore wikians. Know this:When Tesfanon was made, the admins of it sought to made partnerships with other wikias. You were never mentioned. Why? Why the biggest and oldest TES wikia was not mentioned and Elder Scrolls Wikia took its place? Elder Scrolls Wikia is still small and cannot be compared with UESP. But it did. Now with whatever way you react know that I mean no offense and I don't threaten you. So you can't ban me. After all even with ban you won't change anything(For more information see Darth Vukure in SWFanon Wiki).

PS: With the word admins I don't mean specifically them but I brought them as example. Know it is your choice to decide who are they... Lord Geogorath 06:46, 15 May 2009 (EDT)

Umbra

Thanks for wading in and clearing that up--after giving an incorrect reason for why it wasn't really a useful claim and reverting my own reversion I decided to leave it alone! Sigh, why must confusion always travel in my wake...? --Cbh 22:12, 16 May 2009 (EDT)

Repeated spelling miscorrections

After reading the talk page relating to Mr Lelles' Mercandise and his problem with burlaries, or more to the point, our problem with people "correcting" the spelling one way or another, it might be worth embedding an HTML comment next to the offending word to remind over-eager editors not to change it, e.g. "... Lelles' Quality <!-- please do not change to "Mercandise" -->Merchandise sells a wide range of trousers ..."; it's not something that'll be visible until someone presses "edit" so it's not too intrusive, but will hopefully get the point across. Just a thought, anyway. --Cbh 02:31, 23 May 2009 (EDT)

If you'd like to, feel free. But personally I seriously doubt it's worth the effort, especially in this case. There's already such a "do not edit" note further down on The Unfortunate Shopkeeper page, yet that hasn't prevented people from changing the information (nor have similar notes on other pages, such as Oblivion:Umbra (sword)). Furthermore, in the particular case of Mercandise/Merchandise the situation is so complicated that any brief "do not edit" message seems likely to cause more confusion than it prevents: most editors would have no idea why someone would even want to change the word to Mercandise. In fact, I'm not sure that the existing "do not edit" note on the page should really be there any more -- but, again, with such an unusual situation, I've nearly given up figuring out what is or is not correct. --Nephele^Talk 14:18, 25 May 2009 (EDT)

What about just using {{sic}} tags and having it display visibly? --Robin Hood (Talk • E-mail • Contribs) 15:14, 25 May 2009 (EDT)

The edit that initiated this discussion was made to a link, where a sic tag can't be used. In addition, I think a sic tag in this situation suffers from the same problem as any type of note: putting sic next to the correctly-spelled word "Merchandise" and saying that it's not supposed to be incorrectly-spelled as "Mercandise" is likely to confuse nearly everyone reading the page. In fact, it's potentially even worse than a note, since all readers will see the sic tag and be confused, whereas an HTML note would only be seen by editors, who have a somewhat higher chance of knowing the situation. --Nephele^Talk 16:05, 25 May 2009 (EDT)

I guess on reflection the most practical approach is indeed just to keep an eye out. Though I like to think that putting a "do not change" comment next to the word in question might serve as a handy reminder, it probably won't, and I guess the cost/benefit of that and similar ideas is probably not that great (and in some cases counterproductive). Oh well, until I have another bright idea...! :) --Cbh 19:14, 26 May 2009 (EDT)

Sorry about that

Sorry about that deletion of a comment on Oblivion talk:Sideways Cave. Guess that's what happens when you're sick to your nose of patrolling and you're in a rush. As you might noticed, I've given it a shot to the best of my ability. Thanks for reverting my edit, for how strange that might sound! ;) --SerCenKing ^Talk 16:33, 28 May 2009 (EDT)

How to make tooltips?

I remember seeing text with a broken underline on some pages. Hovering over them displays a custom tooltip. What do I do to get these custom tooltips? Thanks. Ong elvin 22:33, 29 May 2009 (EDT)

See Template:Hover --Nephele^Talk 12:26, 30 May 2009 (EDT)

Dealing with poor quality edits

Sorry to harangue you about this, but as the admin I contacted last, I figured you wouldn't mind a bit more haranguing. :D

What's the best way of dealing with poor quality edits such as this? Far from being vandalism, someone's put some work into it, but it's very poorly written and doesn't really add much of use to the article. I'm not convinced that re-writing it from scratch is the best approach here: I'm figuring it's probably best to just revert it, but when it comes to that sort of thing I think it's sensible to ask for guidance first. Or let someone else take the blame! :) --Cbh 02:57, 30 May 2009 (EDT)

Looks like someone else took the blame already ;) In future cases, however, you could also consider moving the new text to the talk page, with some comments about what needs to be done before the content could be moved back onto the article. --Nephele^Talk 12:29, 30 May 2009 (EDT)

Thanks for the tip--I'll do that next time I see that sort of edit (assuming someone else doesn't deal with it while I'm dithering! :D) --Cbh 19:45, 30 May 2009 (EDT)

...I apolgize... o.O --Mr. Oblivion^(T-C) 20:19, 30 May 2009 (EDT)

I should think so! I'm shocked at your decisiveness. :D No, I should learn from it. Anyway, enough of me defacing Mr/s Nephele's page... --Cbh 23:46, 30 May 2009 (EDT)

Templates

It has come to my attention that you are one of the best people to work with templates. After talking with GK, we have decided to make a template for Journal Entries (all of them through all games). However, I am not entirely capable of writing one at this current moment (and I don't want to bother GK with writing an entire one; nor do I want to bother you to write it). After perusing through some of the current templates (such as the NPCSummary, Places templates), I have a slight feel for it, but I am still not entirely ready to make a substantial template. Any advice will be appreciated! Thanks! :) --Mr. Oblivion^(T-C) 14:36, 30 May 2009 (EDT)